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Post by ICW on Nov 27, 2013 19:55:04 GMT -5
The 7-year, $161M they offered him is fair enough and I think that offer has scared off a lot of teams already. Yanks were kinda smart to reveal what they offered him.
I'd do 5/125 in a heartbeat.
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Post by Chip on Nov 27, 2013 20:26:05 GMT -5
yeah, tell him to screw. if his agents are going to push for him getting $30 million a year. Yankees already offered 7 years $160 million....thats not good enough?  Red Sox gave Dustin Pedroia $85 million over 6 years. what does he have? oh thats right, 2 world series rings, a ROY, an AL MVP, 3 gold gloves, a .300 batting average.....etc. someone tell me how the "Market" is $30 million.....hell even $25 million for Cano because he plays for the Yankees? because on a team of average players he was the "best" hitter? the market should be what is any players worth at their current position, both offensively and defensively (anyone not a pitcher) so if you compare Cano to Pedroia....they are pretty damn close. Cano is NOT a $10 MILLION dollar a year better player than Pedroia. Cano & Jay-Z just want to be on the 300 club. They want the status. They want to be able to say "look a me!!! i make a ridiculously large salary to play baseball!!!" all i'm saying is that the Yankees dont NEED to play that stupid game of you offer i offer you counter i counter until January. i have no sympathy for a guy who thinks $22 million dollars a year isn't enough for him. |
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on Nov 28, 2013 9:21:02 GMT -5
Pedroia and Cano are two totally different animals. I dont wanna compare numbers because it will just make me sad but Cano is an MVP candidate every single year, where as I highly doubt Pedroia is going to win another one.
He is also your best player, if you lose Cano and replace him with Omar Infante or Branden Ryan you know how much of a drop off that is?
Pedroia took a discount, not everyone does it. Its just part of the game to ask for a ton of money after watching the Yankees give out insane deals to guys like Texiera, Jeter AGAIN AND AGAIN, A-Rod, why wouldnt Cano ask for his?
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Post by LA Times on Nov 28, 2013 10:44:16 GMT -5
The Hall of Fame ballot was released and these guys should get in
Greg Maddux
Tom Glavine
Frank Thomas
Craig Biggio
Jeff Bagwell
Mike Piazza
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Post by ICW on Nov 28, 2013 11:51:19 GMT -5
My HOF ballot (I'm ignoring the 10 max. votes limit):
Greg Maddux - Easy choice
Tom Glavine - Easy choice
Frank Thomas - Easy choice. Dude was one of the best hitters in baseball
Mike Mussina - Pitched his entire career in the AL East during the height of the steroind era and managed 270 wins, an 123 ERA+, etc...
Jeff Kent - I'm kind eh on Kent but he really was a great hitting 2B
Craig Biggio - 3,000 hits should be an automatic induction.
Jeff Bagwell - Silly he's not in because people suspect he took roids.
Mike Piazza - See Bagwell. Also, one of the best hitting catchers of all time
Tim Raines - Easy choice but played during a time where Ricky Henderson was stealing the show.
Roger Clemens - Easy, easy choice. Stupid steroid stuff gonna keep him out when it shouldn't.
Barry Bonds - See Rocket
Alan Trammel - Criminally underrated.
Edgar Martinez - Yes, voters need to stop with this stupid hatred towards the DH. Greatest DH of all time.
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on Nov 28, 2013 12:13:20 GMT -5
Next year I think its gonna be Thomas, Maddux, Biggio and Piazza.
Eventually it will be Mussina, Schilling, Glavine and hopefully Roger and Bonds. Edgar Martinez would be nice too
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Post by ICW on Nov 28, 2013 12:27:09 GMT -5
I'm iffy on Schilling. I think it'll be awhile before he gets inducted.
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Post by ICW on Nov 28, 2013 12:27:24 GMT -5
Also: Say NO to Jack Morris in the HOF!
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on Nov 28, 2013 13:28:55 GMT -5
I'm iffy on Schilling. I think it'll be awhile before he gets inducted. Might be, but he'll get in. What he did in the postseason, and his peak, arguably put him ahead of Mussina especially when the new thinking voters start looking at more than wins. |
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Post by ICW on Nov 28, 2013 13:38:04 GMT -5
I'm iffy on Schilling. I think it'll be awhile before he gets inducted. Might be, but he'll get in. What he did in the postseason, and his peak, arguably put him ahead of Mussina especially when the new thinking voters start looking at more than wins. I think what's odd about Schilling is that his peak years were very scattered throughout his career. Normally we'd see a player have 7-10 years of dominance but Schilling's career is a bit different. I think he gets in for similar reasons Moose gets in. |
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on Nov 28, 2013 17:55:48 GMT -5
Might be, but he'll get in. What he did in the postseason, and his peak, arguably put him ahead of Mussina especially when the new thinking voters start looking at more than wins. I think what's odd about Schilling is that his peak years were very scattered throughout his career. Normally we'd see a player have 7-10 years of dominance but Schilling's career is a bit different. I think he gets in for similar reasons Moose gets in. Yup, Schilling had an interesting career. I truly believe postseason helps, where as that should put Pettite and Ortiz in if people ignore the PED's and in Ortiz's case hopefully in 8-10 years its all over and everyone else is in I dont think Pettite was all that special BUT put his regular season stuff with his playoff stuff, hes a Hall of Famer. If Jack Morris gets in over some of these guys THIS year, then the Hall of Fame is a bigger joke than anything |
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Nov 28, 2013 22:05:49 GMT -5
Glavine and Maddux are a shoo ins. Both have 300 wins and honestly, I think Maddux might have had the best career we've seen in our lifetime from a guy who was clean. I know there are guys out there now who may be better than him, but you never know if they're going to fall apart. I know Kershaw is 25 and has a pair of Cy Young, but his career is far from over. Tim Lincecum won a pair of Cy Youngs at an early age and now he is not really an ace any more at all. I'm a Phillies fan and I've got mad respect for Maddux. Classy guy, great pitcher.
Honestly, I was on the fence about Frank Thomas until I pulled up his stats. I seemed to remember that he kind of fell off the map due to injuries in his 30s which he kind of did when you look at it. He still finished with a .301 career average, 500 homers and close to 2500 hits. Yeah, he gets in and he should. Biggio ought to be a no-brainer.
I think Bagwell is iffy even without the whiff of 'roids on him (though I have no clue why he smells like 'roids). He's got good numbers, but not great numbers. Piazza may easily be the best hitting catcher of all time, but if I recall, he basically 'fessed up to using 'roids during his career did he not?
Clemens, Bonds and Palmeiro ought to be dropped from eligibility if you ask me. But no one's asking me.
Schilling should NOT get in. I'm a huge fan of Schill being a Phillies fan, but he's just not an HOF pitcher. He won more than 15 games only 4 times in his career. His 216 wins are extremely meh. Kenny Rogers has more W's than Schill does and we'd never consider Rogers. Schill never won a Cy Young and his 3.46 ERA puts him 392nd on the career list. Cole Hamels (not even close to being an HOFer at all) has a better career ERA. His WHIP is like 47th on the list which is good, but hardly great. Honestly, the only case you can make for him his 3k strikeouts putting him 15th on the career list. You start looking at other guys in that area and you come across Mickey Lolich who's career numbers are virtually identically to Schillings. Wins and ERA are virtually identical. Whip is like .1 apart and Schill (who played 4 more years than Lolich) has about 300 or so more strikeouts. Lolich has dropped off the ballot. I don't see how you can put Schill in.
Edgar Martinez should not get in. I just can't take someone serious who claims to be a baseball player, but can't actually catch a baseball. I'll pass.
There's no way you can put Jack Morris in when Tommy John is out. Guy is in the top ten in wins for lefties, but he's dropped off the ballot? Plus he has a freaking surgery named after him that extends careers that previously were over. How can you not put freaking Tommy John in Cooperstown. It's maddening. TRW has his Dale Murphy, I have my Tommy John.
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on Nov 29, 2013 0:48:18 GMT -5
Yeah Hulk we've had this debate like a billion times, you say Schilling wont, I say he will ( I am going to be right), its pointless. You probably hate Schilling because he talked to Carlos Ruiz once.
Your whole diatribe against Schilling forgets one simple fact: What he did in the postseason, measure that up against Mickey Lolich.
Viva Carlos Ruiz!
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Nov 29, 2013 9:41:44 GMT -5
Yeah Hulk we've had this debate like a billion times, you say Schilling wont, I say he will ( I am going to be right), its pointless. You probably hate Schilling because he talked to Carlos Ruiz once. Your whole diatribe against Schilling forgets one simple fact: What he did in the postseason, measure that up against Mickey Lolich. Viva Carlos Ruiz! I hate people who try to make a case for a guy based solely on post season performance. That's pretty much what you're doing with Schilling. Based on his regular season stats, he's really not even a marginal candidate. If he never made the post season we wouldn't even be discussing this. This is where the problem comes in. You drag in post season stuff you immediately handicap guys who played on sucky teams their whole careers. Ryne Sandberg collected all of 15 post season hits his entire career. Do you hold that against him? Of course not. He played his whole career on crappy teams. You look at this regular season stats, see that he's a slam dunk and put him in. Then you look at guys like Schilling or Pettite and their career stats are good, but not great. Now you have to look for an excuse to put them in. Suddenly the post season is a huge factor when it was never a factor for anyone else. Is there anyone in the HOF right now who had a mediocre career, but great post season stats? By the time you're looking at post season performance, you've already admitted that a guys regular season stats aren't enough to get him in. That should be the end of the question right there. If you have a guy who is a good candidate based on regular season stats, then his post season stuff is just gravy. |
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on Nov 29, 2013 13:40:02 GMT -5
Yeah Hulk we've had this debate like a billion times, you say Schilling wont, I say he will ( I am going to be right), its pointless. You probably hate Schilling because he talked to Carlos Ruiz once. Your whole diatribe against Schilling forgets one simple fact: What he did in the postseason, measure that up against Mickey Lolich. Viva Carlos Ruiz! I hate people who try to make a case for a guy based solely on post season performance. That's pretty much what you're doing with Schilling. Based on his regular season stats, he's really not even a marginal candidate. If he never made the post season we wouldn't even be discussing this. This is where the problem comes in. You drag in post season stuff you immediately handicap guys who played on sucky teams their whole careers. Ryne Sandberg collected all of 15 post season hits his entire career. Do you hold that against him? Of course not. He played his whole career on crappy teams. You look at this regular season stats, see that he's a slam dunk and put him in. Then you look at guys like Schilling or Pettite and their career stats are good, but not great. Now you have to look for an excuse to put them in. Suddenly the post season is a huge factor when it was never a factor for anyone else. Is there anyone in the HOF right now who had a mediocre career, but great post season stats? By the time you're looking at post season performance, you've already admitted that a guys regular season stats aren't enough to get him in. That should be the end of the question right there. If you have a guy who is a good candidate based on regular season stats, then his post season stuff is just gravy. Not once did I say "Only reason why hes gonna get in is because his postseason stats" YOu were too busy comparing him to Mickey Lolich and didnt even mention what he did in the postseason. Big difference bud. Curt Schilling is ARGUABLY the greatest post season pitcher ever, put that with what he did in his career which isnt mediocre = Hall of Fame. Not really sure why its so tough for you, the postseason is part of baseball, what people do there counts towards their legacies. This is a foolish debate with you because A) you have an agenda towards Schilling B) agenda towards Spanish players and B) you are a nut job I still love you though |
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Post by Quanthor on Nov 29, 2013 16:22:43 GMT -5
I have mixed feelings about Curt and The Moose getting in. I think the bar gets set a little lower if that happens. However I do think there is something to be said about impact, moments and accomplishments. It is the hall of "fame" after all. I think Curt has those to an extent. The Moose...not so much. If he gets in Bob Welch and Kevin Brown should get in too.
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Post by Chip on Nov 29, 2013 17:05:34 GMT -5
yeah, postseason stats absolutely should count towards HOF status. If they count them towards a players individual achievements, they should be valid with HOF voting. Not like a player who pitches in the postseason is faking it. If you're not counting that part of their careers, why not just replace all players in the PS then?
Schilling should get in based on the fact that he is a "household name" in baseball. He is "famous"....hence, hall of FAME.
Maddox, Glavin, Big Hurt should be easy first ballot guys.
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Post by ICW on Nov 30, 2013 23:27:52 GMT -5
Phil Hughes to the Twins, 3/$24M.
HAPPY TRAILS PHIL HUGHES!
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Post by bad guy™ on Nov 30, 2013 23:30:09 GMT -5
You are going to be soooooo pissed if he has a resurgence like Burnett had when he came to Pittsburgh man. Haha.
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Post by Justin on Nov 30, 2013 23:38:27 GMT -5
Phil Hughes to the Twins, 3/$24M. HAPPY TRAILS PHIL HUGHES! Lol. I heard on a local radio station that the Mets are out of the Hughes lottery and I was like that's a pretty shitty lottery I guess |
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