cyantist
Superstar
Joined on: May 9, 2010 6:47:56 GMT -5
Posts: 950
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Post by cyantist on Aug 18, 2010 17:18:29 GMT -5
So lets look at say the finger poke of doom. In retrospect that is a horrible decision. But back then was it? It got Hogan back over as a Mega heel pissed the fans off to no end. Which either did 1 of 2 things Made them tune it to watch Hogans downfall or Made them watch WWF (which i doubt it would) I didn't watch WCW often back in the day so I don't really have an opinion on them.
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Post by Chicago on Aug 18, 2010 17:21:02 GMT -5
It was a terrible decision for any era.
Also, I don't think pissing your fans off to the point that they stop watching is the making of a properly-booked heel turn.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2010 18:23:25 GMT -5
So lets look at say the finger poke of doom. In retrospect that is a horrible decision. But back then was it? It got Hogan back over as a Mega heel pissed the fans off to no end. Which either did 1 of 2 things Made them tune it to watch Hogans downfall or Made them watch WWF (which i doubt it would) I didn't watch WCW often back in the day so I don't really have an opinion on them. from that moment on WCW started to sink big time.their ratings went into decline badly after this. I remember watching both shows religously and this totally pissed me off and I remember not watching for weeks after.....I was so disgusted Goldbergs streak was ended for this crap. it was an awful booking decision because as the ratings clearly showed people stayed away in droves after this....and didnt nessacerily go to watch WWF either..... |
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Post by slappy on Aug 18, 2010 18:34:31 GMT -5
I think the worse decision was that very episode was the one were they gave away Raw results that Foley won the belt.
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Joined on: Nov 16, 2024 23:28:12 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2010 18:40:36 GMT -5
So lets look at say the finger poke of doom. In retrospect that is a horrible decision. But back then was it? It got Hogan back over as a Mega heel pissed the fans off to no end. Which either did 1 of 2 things Made them tune it to watch Hogans downfall or Made them watch WWF (which i doubt it would) I didn't watch WCW often back in the day so I don't really have an opinion on them. from that moment on WCW started to sink big time.their ratings went into decline badly after this. I remember watching both shows religously and this totally pissed me off and I remember not watching for weeks after.....I was so disgusted Goldbergs streak was ended for this crap. it was an awful booking decision because as the ratings clearly showed people stayed away in droves after this....and didnt nessacerily go to watch WWF either..... Agreed, it was a horrible decision, and seemed to start a trend of insulting the fans' intelligence, which is never good for business. Regarding Goldberg, yeah, the fact his streak ended the way it did also was a letdown, coupled with his heel turn later on when he was really only the last hot draw WCW had. |
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Post by carly1988 on Aug 18, 2010 19:34:25 GMT -5
The finger poke wasnt terrible really. The only bad part about it was the title switched hands for free. Having 2 nWo groups royally sucked. Bringing them back together as a mega group and having the jobbers on the B team.
Sadly the bad booking decisions came after that. They had the group back together and just didnt know what to do with them.
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Post by figurecollector on Aug 18, 2010 19:44:14 GMT -5
David Arquette's and Vince Russo's championships were amongst the worst decisions.
David Flair and Crowbar along with Lenny and Lodi were bad additions and should have never won a match. Letting talent walk out like Jericho, Malenko, Benoit and Eddie G was poor judgement. They should have kept them under any circumstances
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Post by slappy on Aug 18, 2010 22:26:11 GMT -5
David Arquette's and Vince Russo's championships were amongst the worst decisions. David Flair and Crowbar along with Lenny and Lodi were bad additions and should have never won a match. Letting talent walk out like Jericho, Malenko, Benoit and Eddie G was poor judgement. They should have kept them under any circumstances There was no way those 4 were going to stay in WCW, no matter what happened. |
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Post by carly1988 on Aug 18, 2010 22:31:25 GMT -5
David Arquette's and Vince Russo's championships were amongst the worst decisions. David Flair and Crowbar along with Lenny and Lodi were bad additions and should have never won a match. Letting talent walk out like Jericho, Malenko, Benoit and Eddie G was poor judgement. They should have kept them under any circumstances There was no way those 4 were going to stay in WCW, no matter what happened. If they would have started pushing them around 98 when the nWo lost its momentum, I think they would have been around. Of course its hard to say as they all left because of Sullivan. |
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Post by Mr. Orange on Aug 18, 2010 23:57:16 GMT -5
In my opinion, Sting beating Hogan at Starrcade was the beginning of the end for WCW. They booked that angle to PERFECTION. After that though, there wasn't a whole lot going on until Goldberg got hot. WCW was just riding that wave and never got better. But Goldberg losing to Nash was a HUGE nail in the coffin, only to lose to Hogan via the Finger Poke did 3 things that they never recovered from:
1) Insulted our intelligence
2) They ended the hottest thing going at that time. Nash was over, but the streak should never have ended that early. Derailed all Goldberg's momentum. He never, ever got back over thanks to poor booking
The big one:
3) Goldberg NEVER got those big one on one rematches with Nash or Hogan for the belt. He got arrested and beat down. Great way to book him. If they wanted to screw Goldberg out of the title via Hall/Nash at Starrcade, fine. BUT have a plan in place. IMO, if they did this, they could have built everything up for another year. Goldberg would get his ultimate revenge at Starrcade 1999, or they could have ended it in August or something with that whole Bret Hart heel thing.
- Luger turned on Goldberg. It was Hogan/Hall/Nash/Steiner/Luger faction
- Feb PPV: Goldberg def. Luger
- March PPV: Goldberg def. Steiner
- Goldberg then goes into a feud with Scott Hall for a few months(April/May). After all, he started all of this. Hall keeps ducking him and whatnot. Eventually they have a one on one match, Goldberg wrecks him. Then onto Nash
- "Can Goldberg defeat Kevin Nash?, the only man who has ever pinned him?" That practically writes it self. (build through June, PPV match in July)
- After Nash, he tries to get to Hogan, but Hall/Nash/Luger/Steiner keep protecting him and Hogan escapes every time. I'm talking MONTHS here. NO CONTACT WHATSOEVER. The key is to almost give it to people, and keep teasing it but never give it to them until PPV.
- Goldberg vs. Hogan: Starrcade 1999. World Heavyweight Title. The first time Goldberg has gotten more than maybe 5 seconds of contact on Hogan. Goldberg def. Hogan.
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If THAT was the way it was booked, Goldberg would have gotten the belt back to feud with Bret Hart in early 2000, Bret wouldn't have gotten hurt(mere coincidence), and Goldberg would have been over MORE than he was before.
Anyway, WCW had no patience or understanding for this sort of thing so WCW failed. Instead of getting Goldberg back on track we had months of awful booking decisions.
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Post by slappy on Aug 19, 2010 0:11:13 GMT -5
He went 173-0, how much longer would you have liked it to go?
I love that Nash ended it.
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Post by Mr. Orange on Aug 19, 2010 0:36:36 GMT -5
He went 173-0, how much longer would you have liked it to go? I love that Nash ended it. My whole gripe is that if they wanted it to end at Starrcade to Nash, have a booking plan in place for a built up rematch. Hell, if a plan was in place, the Finger Poke o' Doom would have had a PURPOSE instead of just feeding Hogan another title run for the hell of it. There's 2 HUGE PPV one one one rematches for Goldberg, as well as a big Hall/Goldberg matchup. So, 3 huge money makers for WCW in 1999, as well as a smart build up for each over the course of the year, I think WCW wouldn't have been almost dead by 2000. Now having Hall screw Goldberg out of the title at Starrcade, fine and dandy. Goldberg's streak would have ended to a guy that was really over at the time at the biggest show of the year. That in itself, was fine. But they had no plan to go from there and that is what killed Goldberg dead. THAT is what this whole thing is about. I'm not mad Nash beat him. It was, like I said before, at their WrestleMania via screwjob. Logically, wouldn't you want to tune in that next Monday to see what would happen to Goldberg? Would he start get his revenge? Would we see big matches with the whole nWo following that? No, instead he got arrested and sent to jail. Got out, then got beat down. He went from machine to... nothing. I'd have ended that Finger Poke night with an nWo lackey being DESTROYED by an INTENSE Goldberg as the nWo looked on terrified on the ramp, along with Hogan clutching his belt close to his chest. It would get everyone to tune in next week. I honestly can't name a thing Hogan did with that title run or what Goldberg did from then on besides the Bret angle, shredding his arm and turning heel. WCW dropped the ball HUGE here. I've heard writers/wrestlers say that when Goldberg got beat WCW was on borrowed time. Not if WCW had good writers. They could have ended up with something better than before had they done things differently. But this is all speculation. Hindsight is 20/20. Maybe the angle I wrote would have worked, maybe it would have flopped. But it would have been better than what we got. |
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Post by slappy on Aug 19, 2010 0:44:29 GMT -5
Either way, WCW was going out of business because of the AOL/Time Warner merger. So it didn't really matter in the long run.
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Post by gordon on Aug 19, 2010 0:47:32 GMT -5
Either way, WCW was going out of business because of the AOL/Time Warner merger. So it didn't really matter in the long run. WCW went out of business for the same reason ECW went out of business. They couldn't get a TV deal in time. |
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Post by slappy on Aug 19, 2010 1:27:00 GMT -5
Either way, WCW was going out of business because of the AOL/Time Warner merger. So it didn't really matter in the long run. WCW went out of business for the same reason ECW went out of business. They couldn't get a TV deal in time. WCW went out of business because AOL/Time Warner sold it to Vince McMahon. Eric Bischoff had investors ready to buy WCW and they actually reached a deal to buy it, however, one day his friend called him and said "It's done." Bischoff thought the deal was done and they had just purchased WCW. But his friend then explained that the deal was done meaning it was off, because AOL/Time Warner were selling to someone else. And then we find out they sold it to Vince instead. |
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Post by gordon on Aug 19, 2010 1:31:01 GMT -5
WCW went out of business for the same reason ECW went out of business. They couldn't get a TV deal in time. WCW went out of business because AOL/Time Warner sold it to Vince McMahon. Eric Bischoff had investors ready to buy WCW and they actually reached a deal to buy it, however, one day his friend called him and said "It's done." Bischoff thought the deal was done and they had just purchased WCW. But his friend then explained that the deal was done meaning it was off, because AOL/Time Warner were selling to someone else. And then we find out they sold it to Vince instead. As I understood, Fusient Media Ventures (Bischoff) had a deal in place to buy WCW, but pulled out when Jamie Kellner decided to cancel all WCW programming due to low ratings. No one else wanted it, so Vince took the opportunity and bought it himself. |
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Post by slappy on Aug 19, 2010 2:01:03 GMT -5
WCW went out of business because AOL/Time Warner sold it to Vince McMahon. Eric Bischoff had investors ready to buy WCW and they actually reached a deal to buy it, however, one day his friend called him and said "It's done." Bischoff thought the deal was done and they had just purchased WCW. But his friend then explained that the deal was done meaning it was off, because AOL/Time Warner were selling to someone else. And then we find out they sold it to Vince instead. As I understood, Fusient Media Ventures (Bischoff) had a deal in place to buy WCW, but pulled out when Jamie Kellner decided to cancel all WCW programming due to low ratings. No one else wanted it, so Vince took the opportunity and bought it himself. I'm just going by Bischoff's book which said the deal was done but then AOL/Time Warner pulled out in the end and sold it to Vince. |
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Post by gordon on Aug 19, 2010 2:03:20 GMT -5
As I understood, Fusient Media Ventures (Bischoff) had a deal in place to buy WCW, but pulled out when Jamie Kellner decided to cancel all WCW programming due to low ratings. No one else wanted it, so Vince took the opportunity and bought it himself. I'm just going by Bischoff's book which said the deal was done but then AOL/Time Warner pulled out in the end and sold it to Vince. I thought what I said was in Bischoff's book  I don't know, I haven't read it in a while, but I thought I remembered him saying there was no point in buying WCW without a TV deal. |
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Post by slappy on Aug 19, 2010 2:05:27 GMT -5
I'm just going by Bischoff's book which said the deal was done but then AOL/Time Warner pulled out in the end and sold it to Vince. I thought what I said was in Bischoff's book I don't know, I haven't read it in a while, but I thought I remembered him saying there was no point in buying WCW without a TV deal. I just read it some months ago and that's what I recall reading. |
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Post by gordon on Aug 19, 2010 2:15:25 GMT -5
I thought what I said was in Bischoff's book I don't know, I haven't read it in a while, but I thought I remembered him saying there was no point in buying WCW without a TV deal. I just read it some months ago and that's what I recall reading. I just quickly found his book, skipped to the sale part. Bischoff agreed a deal to buy WCW, everything was ready to go until he got the "it's done" phone call. Jamie Kellner had cancelled all WCW programming, meaning the deal was worthless so they pulled out. They tried negotiating getting WCW Nitro/Thunder on FX, but ultimately it didn't work out and the deal was dead. Since Viacom didn't have an issue with programming anymore, Vince was able to buy WCW's trademarks, talent etc. |
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