Any idea why Vader wore his singlet backwards?

[Ultimate Figure Collector]

I remember watching Royal Rumble 1996 as a kid and Vader coming out with his singlet backwards. Me and my brother use to joke around saying he put it on backwards and didn't wanna change. However, I was watching RAW(the night after the rumble) on WWE 24/7 and he''s wearing it backwards again. Does anyone know why he would do this? Was it maybe some sort of rib?

[gravedigger3]

got a pic?
never noticed anything like that so wouldnt be able to tell you

[gordon]

An even better question is to why the WWF completely crapped all over Vader in 1998 and he lost almost all of his matches and was relegated to working Sunday Night Heat.

[Deleted]

He didnt start wearing "Vader Time" on the front till much later. Just how he did things. And I agree with Cam. I mean seriously, what the ? At one time he was slated to be the monster champion, but then Michaels threw a bitchfit and ever since he was pushed down the card.

[Chicago]

I always thought he put it on backwards and simply didn't care enough to change it around.

I wish I knew so I could tell you but, then again, I don't really want to know why Vader did certain things lol.

Still, I find now is the best time to share a very informative post I read from someone on another forum about Vader's time with the WWF.

Politics, injuries, bad booking and weight problems are what kept Vader from achieving any success in the WWF.

From right off the bat when Vader entered the WWF at the beginning of 1996, things were going bad for him.

Vader was originally supposed to wrestle Savio Vega at the Royal Rumble in a singles match and Vader would go over. But that idea got changed at the last minute and Vader was entered into the Royal Rumble which hurt his credibility as a monster immediately.

HHH was supposed to win the 1996 King of the Ring and have an IC run but that was thrown out of the window when he disobeyed Vince and had the infamous MSG Clique Hug that led to HHH being punished while Shawn was given an insignificant fine. However, Austin was not the first choice to be HHH's replacement in the tournament. The booking squad, which was headed by Jim Cornette at the time, wanted Vader to be the winner of the KOTR tournament in order to give Vader some more heat going into his match with Shawn Michaels at Summerslam. But that idea was changed when Shawn went to Vince and said that Vader was being pushed too hard as his challenger and how someone who could actually use the KOTR title should win the tournament. Cornette was furious when Vince told him to have Vader lose in the semi-finals which Cornette booked as a DQ so Vader would not look weak by losing to Jake Roberts.

The most devastating event in Vader's WWF run was when he was supposed to beat Shawn Michaels clean for the WWF title at Summerslam but the decision was changed at last minute. This came about due to Shawn bitching about how Vader was killing the house shows that he main evented on and how Vader would not be able to have any credible opponents to wrestle as a heel. Vince changed the decision to have Vader beat Shawn cleanly for the WWF title about an hour before the show went on the air.

This move hurt the WWF more than they realized at the time because Vince had told the cable companies to put out adds with Vader as the champ and the In Your House PPV: It's Time was dedicated to WWF Heavyweight champion Vader. The PPV companies were scared that they would be charged with false advertising and demanded that Vince compensate them for the changes in the ads, which was pricey for the WWF.

After Summerslam, Vader's knees were hurting him and he was forced to take some time off after the PPV. Cornette did not want Vader to be forgotten so he had him interfere in the Mindgames match between Shawn and Mankind after Shawn had thrown a temper tantrum about jobbing to a jobber like Mankind who had no heat. Cornette and Shawn were locking horns more and more as time went on in regards to issues concerning Shawn and who he was supposed to job the title to.

The Survivor Series '96 PPV was the show that was supposed to revive Vader's career because Cornette was pushing for Vader to have another shot at trying to get a title run. Vader was penciled in to beat Sid at the IYH before the show, which was to determine the challenger to Shawn's belt. But Shawn threw a huge temper tantrum at the day of the show and said how Vader was working too stiff with him on shows and how he felt that Sid, an unproven commodity, would be a better choice as champ and would draw better then Vader. Also add in that Vader was still having knee problems which didn't help Vince's confidence in Vader at all and Vince decided to give the nod to Sid in beating Vader in the contender's match and which would lead to Sid beating Shawn for the title at Survivor Series '96. Cornette was furious that his booking plans were changed again due to Shawn's bullcrapand he was on the verge of quitting his job as the head booker of the WWF after this.

Third time's a charm...right?

Fate intervened and Vader was granted one more chance at winning the WWF title.

A few weeks before the February IYH, Shawn had vacated his WWF title due to an addiction to painkillers/did not want to job the title to Bret/had knee problems/take your/etc. and Vince scrambled to see who would make a good champ. Cornette saw his chance and proposed that Vader finally be given the title run that he had been promised a year earlier and Cornette almost got his request. Vader was scheduled to face the winner of the Final Four PPV, which was originally going to have Bret Hart, Steve Austin, the Undertaker, and Sid Vicious. A week before the PPV, Vader had slipped on some water in the gorilla spot and had bruised his knee badly after he slipped which was the same knee that he had been trying to heal up. Vince heard what happened to Vader and decided right there that Sid would be the one who would face the winner of the Final Four PPV on the RAW the night after. The original winner of the Final Four PPV was supposed to be Steve Austin who Jim Cornette had booked in order to capitalize on the heat that Austin was drawing at the time. Cornette was going to change the winner of the match from Austin to Vader but Vince vetoed the idea because Vince himself wanted to capitalize on Austin's success and Vader was left out in the cold.

On the night of the PPV, Austin had injured his knee badly in the middle of the match and told Jim Ross about it near ringside. Austin told Ross that he would not be able to go on much longer and told Ross to change the finish of the match and give the title to someone else. Ross panicked and asked Vince on his headset whom should win the match and Vince told him that Austin's replacement would be Bret Hart. Bret ended up winning the match and lost to Sid the next night on the RAW where he faced Sid due to interference by Steve Austin.

Vader's weight was also starting to become an issue with the WWF management and he was being recognized as a slob in the back who could not keep his weight in check. Vader's knees were also still sore from his slipping on water incident. Vader was also being threatened by various workers about how stiff he worked matches and how they would get him fired if he did not tone down his style which caused him to lose all track of how he could work a match.

The big man was at a crossroads and looked like he was heading in the wrong direction.

Vader's final brush with the possible chance to win some WWF gold was when Cornette booked him and Mankind to win the WWF Tag Titles from the team of Owen Hart and the British Bulldog at Wrestlemania 13. Everything was going fine until Bret Hart spoke with Cornette about how Owen and the Bulldog should retain the tag titles to give them some heat since they were going to be in a heel stable with Bret. Cornette had his hesitations about not giving Vader some WWF gold like he had promised his big friend, but Bret convinced him how it would be good for business and Cornette was sold. Bret and Cornette discussed with Vader about the change in the match and Vader had no problem with it and knew that Bret's request was noble and not selfish like Shawn's requests in the past were.

After Wrestlemania, Vader was pretty much a midcarder for the remainder of his career in the WWF. His weight was becoming an issue with the WWF and Vader was sent to train and lose a copious amount of weight several times but never went ahead and lost the weight. Jim Cornette was also fired as the WWF booker in April of '97 as the WWF's head booker and WWF editor/writer Vince Russo took over the reigns of the head booker's position. Russo did not like Vader and felt that his weight and his look would not get him heat and let Vader muddle around in the midcard. Russo did give Vader a halfhearted push as a member of the Pro-American group that was feuding with the Hart Foundation but had no intentions of giving Vader a serious run as a threat.

Vader's last brush with possible success was when Jim Ross tossed around the idea about making Mankind and Vader two of Vince's corporate champions. But the idea was nixed by Russo after Vader had told Russo that he was unable to lose any weight while he had taken time off after his No Way Out '98 match with Kane. The match was made so that Vader could fix the plate that was lose in his face that held together his eye socket which had come undone after Kane had given Vader a sloppy Tombstone Piledriver.

Russo became frustrated with Vader's weight problems and told him that he would be jobbing out the remainder of his contract with the WWF. Vader jobbed to the Undertaker in less then half a minute on a July Raw which pretty much signaled the end of any of Vader's credibility as a monster in the WWF.

Vader's contract with the WWF was up in December of '98 and he signed with All Japan Pro Wrestling almost immediately after that. He could not wrestle in New Japan because he still had heat with management from past incidents and Bischoff did not want anything to do with him after the shaky past they had along with Vader being damaged goods.

The big man took a lot of abuse in his WWF and he is fortunate enough to still have a steady job with Pro Wrestling NOAH and it looks as if he will finish out his career in Japan. Vader's health has been an issue in the last couple months and had what many people thought was a stroke/heart attack back in May of '02 along with a series of knee surgeries.

Vader is the greatest big man of all time in professional wrestling and is an easy HOFer with all of the accolades he has collected throughout his illustrious career. As of this month, Vader is rehabbing a pair of sore knees and will probably miss the rest of NOAH's tour and might be out for the first part of the next tour.

- As of October 7, 2002.


WWF Booking in Early 1997:

Here was what the original plan that Cornette had for the WWF starting at Royal Rumble '97 leading up to Mania 13:

- Shawn would beat Sid for the belt and would hold onto the belt until Mania 13.

- Bret and Austin would wrestle each other at the February IYH to determine who would wrestle Shawn for the belt after Austin had eliminated Bret as the last man in the Royal Rumble yet Austin had been eliminated earlier in the Rumble by Bret.

- Bret and Shawn would wrestle each other for the Heavyweight belt at Mania 13 after Bret had beaten Austin for the right to wrestle Shawn.

- Bret was going to turn heel in the match ala Bret/Austin because regardless of whom Bret would wrestle at Mania 13, he was going to be a heel by the end of the night. Corny and Bret had planned for him to turn heel as far back as Survivor Series '96.

- The plan for the Bret/Shawn match was for Bret to catch Shawn's Sweet Chin Music and to get Shawn in an ankle lock and break his ankle with the help of a fake ankle attachment that would make it look as if Bret had really snapped Shawn's ankle.

- Bret had been promised a rematch with Shawn at Mania 13 after he came back to the WWF in October of '96.

- The Hart Foundation was originally only going to start out with Bret being the only member with gold in the group but that did not happen due to Shawn's leave. Bret would not get the match he wanted with Shawn and Vince felt that it was time to reward the Undertaker with a run with the title after the years of loyalty he had supplied for the WWF.

- Bret thought that the Hart Foundation needed some gold to start out with and that is why Bret came to Cornette with the idea to have DBS and Owen retain the tag titles against Vader/Mankind. Cornette agreed to the idea and all parties involved agreed as well.

- The Undertaker was given the ME spot against Sid at Mania 13 and Vince and Cornette decided to let Bret and Austin wrestle one another in a rematch from their Survivor Series '96 match. Bret and Austin came up with the idea to make their match a submission match. Cornette and Vince liked the idea of having Austin in an submission match with the WWF's submission specialist because it was thought that it would help make Austin look like a bad ass if he did not submit to Bret. Bret would also get to turn heel like he was scheduled to and would be 2 - 0 against Austin which would help make Austin's future matches with Bret seem more important.

[gordon]

Hmm, that was an interesting read, thanks Chicago.

[Greensborohill]

Good stuff.

Austin deserved to go over Bret at WM14 for the title. It would have been more fitting.

[Deleted]

that was a great post Chicago +1 for you.

[Deleted]

Awesome read Chicago, thanks again for sharing.

[Patrick Bateman (original)]

I remember at the end of a Vader match on a PPV he took the mic and said " I'm so fat. I'm just a fat pile of sh*t". That's when I knew Vader was done.

[slappy]

THanks for that, it's a shame Shawn had to pull what he did, Vader should have been champ.

[Calcifer Boheme]

He did that from time to time... I have no idea why, but the time mentioned was not the only time he did it.


I'm sad he never won the WWF title. but really, even though he had other shots, I think the Summerslam match was his only real chance. His star fell, and other guys came up, particularly Steve Austin. It would have been a wonderful crowning achievement in his career, but even without it he had a fantastic one and that can't be taken away from him.

[DKR]

Jan 21, 2010 21:53:40 GMT -5 Patrick Bateman (original) said:

I remember at the end of a Vader match on a PPV he took the mic and said " I'm so fat. I'm just a fat pile of sh*t". That's when I knew Vader was done.

My brother and I still laugh about that...I felt bad for Vader.

[Johnny Lawrence - Cobra Kai]

Jan 21, 2010 21:53:40 GMT -5 Patrick Bateman (original) said:

I remember at the end of a Vader match on a PPV he took the mic and said " I'm so fat. I'm just a fat pile of sh*t". That's when I knew Vader was done.

I remember that. It immediately turned Vader from the wrecking machine he had been for years, into nothing but a sad fat guy who no longer believed in himself. Once your character goes in that direction, you're done.

[cmpunk09]

yeah, I like Shawn, but that craphe pulled back in the days was completely out of line.

[Jimmy]

Vader along with the LOD were jobbed out in 1998 basically as a way of showing 'out with the old, in with the new'. I give him a lot of credit for putting various guys over.

[Emerald Enthusiast]

Jan 21, 2010 21:56:22 GMT -5 slappy said:

THanks for that, it's a shame Shawn had to pull what he did, Vader should have been champ.

He should have been champ in WCW again too. His feud with Hogan could have been so much better but it was completely one-sided.

Also, Vader's weight did spiral out-of-control for awhile. From the time he first beat Sting for the WCW belt to his WWF introduction, he looked like he might have gained 50lbs. Ironically, he lost weight in '98 but the damage to his character was already done at that point.

[LeighD]

Thanks chicago for that info. I knew HBK was some how behind Vader's no title reign. Goes to show you how much people respected Bret vs. HBK back then.

I was pissed Vader never won the belt or even a title in the WWF. I was even more pissed Vader was jobbed out, along with LOD, in mid-1998.

[HugoOne]

Jan 24, 2010 2:34:28 GMT -5 Jimmy said:

Vader along with the LOD were jobbed out in 1998 basically as a way of showing 'out with the old, in with the new'. I give him a lot of credit for putting various guys over.

He made Kane look like gold. I remember Kane bashing Vader in the face with a wrench and being young, I thought he really caved Vader's face in.

[Rant Casey]

Jan 24, 2010 15:16:20 GMT -5 HugoOne said:

Jan 24, 2010 2:34:28 GMT -5 Jimmy said:

Vader along with the LOD were jobbed out in 1998 basically as a way of showing 'out with the old, in with the new'. I give him a lot of credit for putting various guys over.

He made Kane look like gold. I remember Kane bashing Vader in the face with a wrench and being young, I thought he really caved Vader's face in.

That was one of the things that made me legit scared of Kane as a child. I miss those days.